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Alegre's Corner
We're not finished folks - not by a long shot!

Prominent Dem Flubs $64,000 Question

by: Alegre

Tue Jul 29, 2008 at 13:57:28 PM EDT


Marc Ambinder posed an interesting question to his readers this morning and given the make-up of the folks who frequent his blog (pro-BHO for the most part) I expected a flood of posts singing BHO's praises regarding his legislation to rename that post office etc.  Sadly, there are (as of this writing) only 27 replies and several were duplicates by some eager beaver bots who hit post a few times more than they probably intended.

His jumping off point for the column was something posted by Richard Cohen in todays Washington Post.  Now Ive never been a big fan of Cohens, but the guy really does raise a fair question here.  After quoting the $64,000 question (tell me one thing Barack Obama has done that you admire), he asks his readers what they admire about him

I'm interested in answers to the question, not criticisms of Cohen's motives or of the premise of the question. What has Obama done that you admire?  I'll post the more interesting responses.

First one up was someone who said they liked that BHO taught Constitutional law.  In looking through the replies there really isnt much substance there.  At least legislatively.  They talk of how he overcame racism, took a low-paying job out of law school, and gave some mighty fine speeches.  All admirable qualities to be sure.  After all, a lot of what our Commander in Chief does is speechifying right?  

But the thing is, the guys been running for the top job in the land for over 18 months now so youd think his followers and surrogates would know his record of accomplishments inside and out by now.  At least to the point where they can talk in detail about his experience and qualifications to be Commander in Chief etc.  Sadly  no.  

Alegre :: Prominent Dem Flubs $64,000 Question
Apparently, the prominent Democrat to whom Cohen posed this question couldnt come up with much either.

"Just tell me one thing Barack Obama has done that you admire," I asked a prominent Democrat. He paused and then said that he admired Obama's speech to the Democratic convention in 2004. I agreed. It was a hell of a speech, but it was just a speech.

Now granted that poor Dem must have been caught flat-footed by Cohen but come on after what happened to that poor schumck in the lead-up to the Texas primaries youd think theyd have a few talking points at the ready by this point.

More from todays column

All politicians change their positions, sometimes even because they have changed their minds. McCain must have suffered excruciating whiplash from totally reversing himself on George Bush's tax cuts. He has denounced preachers he later embraced and then, to his chagrin, has had to denounce them all over again. This plasticity has a label: pandering. McCain knows how it's done.

But Obama has shown that in this area, youth is no handicap. He has been for and against gun control, against and for the recent domestic surveillance legislation and, in almost a single day, for a united Jerusalem under Israeli control and then, when apprised of U.S. policy and Palestinian chagrin, against it. He is an accomplished pol -- a statement of both admiration and a bit of regret.

The question I posed to that prominent Democrat was just my way of thinking out loud. I know that Barack Obama is a near-perfect political package. I'm still not sure, though, what's in it.

I think millions of us are just as stumped as to what's in that shiny package.  After all this time and ALL that media coverage (24/7!) you'd think we'd all have a better idea as to what the guy's all about.

At any rate, I thought maybe we could lend them a hand in coming up with some responses here.  Tell us what you admire about the chosen one.

Ok this is snark but I thought it was worth a post.  Have fun.  

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this seems vaguely familiar... (0.00 / 0)
...and they've had since february to study up. even when you ask a broader question - what you admire about him vs. legislative accomplishments - they still stammer and equivocate.



Barack Obama's election proves that any male can grow up to be president, provided he's willing to use misogyny as a campaign strategy.


yes, it's hardly new (0.00 / 0)
we accuse the bots of focusing on Hillary all the time because they can't say positive things about him, and they never respond with their admiration of him and why, but paint Hillary to be a monster and he must save us from her. That's why he won't pick Hillary, even though just on experience and competence she'd be the best pick.  His supports admire him for letting them see how awful she is and for informing them about her 'racist' campaign. Not good.  

Hillary - alternative energy

[ Parent ]
Get the same umm, Uh.. response from the bots (0.00 / 0)
at NQ most of the time too. But I'm gonna bring up Kos' retort because I'm still flabbergasted at what it might mean:
"Obama is an outsider agent of change"

Does it mean O is not a Democrat? Not an American? What the heck does it mean?

I'm serious about it peaking my curiosity factor.


Outsider agent of change (0.00 / 0)
Well, kos certainly didn't specify "Washington" outsider did he. On the surface, it's an innocuous statement where most readers would fill in meaning with "Washington outsider" -- but it certainly can be interpreted differently and is suspect because it refers to Obama, the vast abyss. No one really knows where he stands. Is he a progressive, or a Neo Con? Is he liberal or conservative? Is he a socialist or an imperialist? Is Obama a liberal facist like Kos?

It's hard to tell which is why I wouldn't trust him with taking my trash out much less handing him the reigns to the world economy.  

Alice left me in Wonderland.  


[ Parent ]
vast abyss (0.00 / 0)

"Is he a progressive, or a Neo Con? Is he liberal or conservative? Is he a socialist or an imperialist? Is Obama a liberal facist like Kos?"

Well, maybe he's just above it all. An above-it-all agent-of-change.  Or just a quintessential empty suit.  He's a real nowhere man making all his nowhere plans for nobody. (thank you, Beatles)


[ Parent ]
OUTSIDER AGENT of CHANGE (0.00 / 0)
I agree, it's an interesting ambigious comment, as if he doesn't stand with anyone in the "current" government.

As far as "unity" and crossing bi-partisan borders, this OUTSIDER isn't going to accomplish much, from either side.

God HELP us if this man, even REMOTELY wins in AUGUST.


[ Parent ]
Washington outsider (0.00 / 0)
(due to having spent no time in the Senate). Chicago insider. Change we can believe in?

[ Parent ]
Outsider agent of change?? (0.00 / 0)
Would someone point out to that little idiot that the terrorists who flew the planes into the WTC were also "outsider agents of change"? And they caused a lot more changes than Obama ever will.  

Live your life in such a way that when your feet
hit the floor in the morning, Satan shudders & says
'Oh $#!%'...she's awake!!


[ Parent ]
Outsider agent of change?? (0.00 / 0)
Would someone point out to that little idiot that the terrorists who flew the planes into the WTC were also "outsider agents of change"? And they caused a lot more changes than Obama ever will.  

Live your life in such a way that when your feet
hit the floor in the morning, Satan shudders & says
'Oh $#!%'...she's awake!!


[ Parent ]
The little admiration (0.00 / 0)
that I still have for Obama is eclipsed by my contempt for him.

On one hand, it is truly wonderful that an AA can be competitive for the office of the presidency. I celebrate it. However, on the other hand, I absolute reject and deplore the dirty and undemocratic methods that the candidate, his campaign, his surrogates, and members of the DNC used to obtain the nomination for him.

Obama will earn my respect and admiration when he concedes the nomination to Hillary Clinton, the rightful party nominee, at the convention. Hillary was elected by the people, won the popular vote, won the Democratic party base, won all the states a Dem must win. To deny her the nomination is a theft not only to her and her supporters, but to democracy.    

Alice left me in Wonderland.  


I was so excited in the beginning about both (0.00 / 0)
Hillary and Obama being candidates. The empowerment of such large groups of people seemed so democratic. But we all know how we and Hillary were treated and the more I listened to Obama the less I heard and he truly is an Empty Suit being propped up because he's fresh?  That has killed any respect for this party and candidate. The only glimmer of a chance that I could vote democrat this GE is if Hillary gets the nomination at the convention or is chosen for VP. Because I know Obama has some stuff in his background that will come out after the convention and he'll have to step aside and Hillary can gain her rightful place. Why the Dems didn't VET him before all this is astounding to me.

This whole primary is bizarre and Obama gives me the same negative feelings I had about Bush. 100% same intuitions.


[ Parent ]
same negative feelings (0.00 / 0)
I agree. I feel the same way about Obama that I did about Bush. I can actually tolerate Bush more now than I can tolerate Obama. You know that's bad.  

Alice left me in Wonderland.  

[ Parent ]
What an ODD COINCIDENCE, (0.00 / 0)
I've been bantoring back and forth with an SD, I wrote a letter to yesterday, and I ASKED Her the SAME THING.

She told me he is doing a GREAT JOB,

I replied:  HE IS??? and just what job is that, that he's so great at.  WHAT HAS HE DONE>

Here's the copy of it:

This was my last response, I just sent minutes ago, she hasn't answered me yet, but it's interesting to read

Start at the bottom and scroll up to catch it in order
-----------------------------------------------------------
--you went off the subject, WHAT HAS HE DONE, to be president, except raise and spend money??

I could care less you don't like HILLARY, and forcing her down your throat is not my intention.  

You haven't answered the question, you side-stepped it, as if your being attacked.

You do alot of BO's blog, I can tell.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Robin Bryant [mailto:rhorne38@hotmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 1:43 PM
To: ME !!
Subject: RE: The Day Democracy Died - week 5

You see the thing I don't care about hillary's resume nor do I fall in love with that fact that if she is in office it will be another Bill Clinton.  See that's what the problem is you think your getting Bill and the fact that you are a woman and she is too. She's not my favorite.  Why do you people constantly try to push her down Obama supporters throats?  The same conviction and loyalty you have for her we have for Obama.  You can say Obama isn't this or that and we could do the same about Hillary.  One stricting difference is Obama is the nominee and don't give me that presumptive crap because you know like I do 99.9 percent he will be it.  So save your lines and glory for Hillary and it's not that I don't like her.  Actually I respect her because in the end she did support the nominee and continues you to do so because she see's the big picture and that is a dem in the white house and like she explained to all of you in denial her and Obamas ideas are exactly the same but for some reason you guys just don't get and then have the nerve to call yourselves dems.  

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Subject: RE: The Day Democracy Died - week 5
> Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 20:29:17 -0400
> From:  ME !!
> To: rhorne38@hotmail.com
>
> And throughout it all, with his record, he claimed he "stood against the war" but not being in the Senate, he didn't know what he would have done. As far as his health care, no real accomplishment there, but "words". As far as beating Bush, I don't think he has the credentials or the experience to go up against the GOP----too bad he didn't want to "learn" first, then Lead
>
> I could give you a resume of my candidate with real accomplishments, real courage, the real "steel" it takes to beat the Bush admin.
>
> From my viewpoint, where Mr. Obama Stands, he's alot closer to the BUSH admin, then anyone is willing to admit, EXCEPT, the ones who don't want to vote for him.
>
> He does have CHARISMA, I'll give you that (good looking too)----I may as well as vote for Mr. Movie Star (He might beat George, as far as the sexiest man alive)---other than that, you won't see him as President in November. You understimate, us "old" bitter ladies.
----------------------------------------------------------

From: Robin Bryant [mailto:rhorne38@hotmail.com]
> Sent: Mon 7/28/2008 4:03 PM
> To: ME !!
> Subject: RE: The Day Democracy Died - week 5
>
>
> He has stood against a war that 4000 plus have died for and we still don't know what the prize is for their deaths. He has fought and is still fighting for those veterans to be rewarded with the old GI Bill. He has put together a healtcare plan that would eliminate the not so wealthy from being turned away and the one major thing that he has that I hope to see is NO MORE BUSH ADMINISTRATION.
>
> -------------------------------------------------------> ______________________________
>
> Subject: RE: The Day Democracy Died - week 5
> Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 15:53:20 -0400
> From: ME !!
> To: rhorne38@hotmail.com
>
>
> As far as him "doing a great job", just what is it he is doing?? / or done??
>
> Start here and scrollup:______________________________

>
> ______________________________
>
---------------------------------------------------------


They absolutely cannot (0.00 / 0)
answer that question.

There's nothing inside that package.

It's like buying a box of a new kind of cereal because the box is well-designed, then opening it and finding there's no cereal included.


[ Parent ]
No, (0.00 / 0)
There is always something inside, but it is crap.  

His high level supporters hope that they can so coat the crap with honey that you won't notice it.  


[ Parent ]
my contribution... (0.00 / 0)
was this:

"obam made it possible for alice palmer to spend more time with her family."

Barack Obama's election proves that any male can grow up to be president, provided he's willing to use misogyny as a campaign strategy.


He might as well have asked why they don't use their brains (0.00 / 0)
A better question: what is it about Obama that turns you into a nasty abusive brown shirt?
Back in March, I saw someone I knew, smart progressive - go in under one minute from "I lean Obama" to "I hate her" with eyes bulged and popping veins in the neck. And when reminding her her state (Mass) went for Hillary the answer was: "None of my friends voted for her" All righty then!

yeah, where's the hope? (0.00 / 0)
the obama operation is the most republican democratic campaign i've ever seen.

Barack Obama's election proves that any male can grow up to be president, provided he's willing to use misogyny as a campaign strategy.

[ Parent ]
Here have some hope (0.00 / 0)


Fighting for women at Partizane

[ Parent ]
Coward Dean called protesters "Low Class" (0.00 / 0)
Is there no end to the friggin' insults?
Article about it up at NQ.

honestly (0.00 / 0)
I don't know what he's accomplished.  The jokes "no one has done more for ..... Than Barack Obama".  And its like a madlib sentence at this point.  Instead of talking about specific accomplishments, they astroturf the perception......   Anyway I used to admire Barack Obama because he .... Well... To use the venacular he totally NAILED the netroots on their contrived narratives.  This was in the now famous truth and tone letter to the dailykos crew.

He talked how legislators make votes that are sometimes difficult to explain essentially pointing that a guy like feingold can vote to confirm Roberts out of deference to authority a president has to nominate who he sees fit.  It's a constitutional premise.  And of course that doesn't feingold is going to be happy with every decision that comes from Roberts.  Or even supports Robert's philosophy.

This was the sane and confident Barack Obama who I would have supported enthusiastically.

He also talked about travelling throughout Illinois and meeting people who were tired of narratives that one would ..... I'll just post a diary about this later tonight or this week....

Suffice to say I used to admire Barack Obama.  


Do backhanded compliments count? (0.00 / 0)
Because the only accomplishment I can think of (besides probably throwing more people under the bus than I have ever seen before in any campaign) is how effectively he has turned the Obama Fan Club members into pretzels as they try to rationalize why they should still vote for him. All the OFC has left, as exemplified by Robin Bryant's pathetic email responses, is that "he's not Bush". That's an accomplishment alright. It just isn't one I'd want to brag about.

re: BHO fans (0.00 / 0)

I love the pretzel imagery!

[ Parent ]
Well a pretzel almost did Bush in.. (0.00 / 0)
one can hope.

[ Parent ]
Good metaphors. (0.00 / 0)
Could we agree to call them cheetos and pretzels? Those in agreement, raise hand!

[ Parent ]
Or, O'miracle (0.00 / 0)
defined as turning cheetos into pretzels.  

[ Parent ]
A strong, courageous, and decisive statement from BHO (0.00 / 0)

Anyone pick up on this?

According to current U.S. News and World Report magazine, on his overseas campaign trip:

Obama was overheard saying: "Blackwater is getting a bad rap."

Remember sometime ago Hillary said she would support legislation to outlaw Blackwater and other mercenary groups?  When asked about it, Obama just did another "graceful" dodge.   Why weren't the progressives after him on this?  

Somebody ought to ask KOS people and MoveOn what they think about his above recent comment.  I wonder if Huff Post has anything up about this.  I'll go check now.  They ought to run BHO's Blackwater remark as their top-of-the-page huge headline in a bright color!  Where's the progressive outrage?!


Do You Have a Link re Blackwater Quote? (0.00 / 0)
If so, this is Definitely worth pulling together a diary - including your reference to that bill that would outlaw mercenary groups like Blackwater.   Hillary stood firm on this while BHO...?  Not so much :(

Invest in Women - Change the World
http://twitter.com/alegrescorner


[ Parent ]
link (0.00 / 0)

Here's the link to U.S. News online magazine. It's also in the regular magazine (Washington Whispers section), where I came across it.

Since it's U.S. News that reported his comment, I'm thinking it must be valid even though they don't say exactly who it was that heard BHO say that.

http://www.usnews.com/blogs/wa...  


[ Parent ]
YIKES! (0.00 / 0)
That article says they helped out with his "security" on his overseas trip and now are hoping it gets them on his good side! (paraphrasing)

So now we know why he flipped! Blackwater protected his skinny ass! He can't visit our wounded troops and he uses mercenaries for his protection. How many times and in how many ways will he diss the military???


[ Parent ]
Blackwater Did His Security???? (0.00 / 0)
They really did the security for that trip he just took?

Lads we have GOT to do a diary on this little gem.

Invest in Women - Change the World
http://twitter.com/alegrescorner


[ Parent ]
ok (0.00 / 0)

I won't have time to really focus on it till tomorrow though. When Blackwater came up during primaries, I think Obama's position was he didn't support an outright ban, but it's ok for them to be brought to trial if they do something wrong!  Something like that.  I have to check it.


[ Parent ]
Great - It's All Yours Then - Go For It! (0.00 / 0)
You found it so this one's yours to fire up.  Can't wait to see what you pull together tomorrow on this one! ;o)

Invest in Women - Change the World
http://twitter.com/alegrescorner


[ Parent ]
bought off? (0.00 / 0)
But Obama of course is not beholden to evil lobbyists. Check out this out.  You'll love the convention bag!

http://www.salon.com/opinion/g...

cc to MilitaryMom



[ Parent ]
re: "gets them on his good side" (0.00 / 0)

same for AT&T!! Coinciding with Sen. Obama's FISA vote, AT&T has been shelling out big bucks to the Democratic Convention.  Get a load of the welcame bag to be distributed to thhose attending the convention:

http://www.salon.com/opinion/g...



[ Parent ]
"Always aim high, work hard, and care deeply about what you believe in. When you stumble, keep faith. When you?re knocked down, get right back up. And NEVER listen to anyone who says you can't or shouldn't go on."
Hillary Clinton - June 7, 2008

Hillary Clinton
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