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Alegre's Corner
We're not finished folks - not by a long shot!

"Democratic Party maybe presumes too much - about women"

by: Radiowalla

Tue Jul 29, 2008 at 17:19:31 PM EDT


( - promoted by masslib)

This morning's SF Chronicle carried an op-ed by Robin Lakoff, a linguist on the faculty of UC Berkeley.  Just the title, "Democratic Party maybe presumes too much - about women," had me cheering over my Cheerios.

Lakoff is disturbed and angry about the flagrant sexism and flagrantly anti-democratic primary elections:

First, of course, is the failure of the party leaders to comment on the sexism rampant in the media, especially the liberal media, for months on end.

Second - and this factor bothers me, and no doubt others, perhaps the most: Why did the superdelegates move in such numbers to support Obama? Why did this occur, especially after Clinton victories? For example, I am thinking here of Robert Byrd. After Clinton's impressive victory in West Virginia, the senator and elder statesman representing that state came out in support of Obama. Because the superdelegates were created to ensure that the Democratic candidate be a centrist, why did so many superdelegates - including liberals and many women - support Obama? Two arguments were made: They wished to follow the will of the people in their district; and they believed that Obama was more electable. But as the Byrd case shows, the first claim was often false; and no one has any idea which of the two, Clinton or Obama, would be more electable in November. It seemed to me that the term was more often used as a kind of excuse, "I'm voting for Obama, but I can't really tell you why," than a reasoned argument.

.

Although she isn't ready to say that she won't vote for Obama, she is plenty pissed at the party and seems to imply that she may have re-registered:

So many women feel that the election was somehow stolen, and by their own party, to boot. They thus feel much the way many Democrats feel about the 2000 election: bitter. When one side feels that they lost an election fairly, any bitterness recedes early on (think of the 2004 election, by comparison). But when the adjective "stolen" leaps to mind, bitterness is apt to prevail, vanquishing any desire for reconciliation and cooperation. That is what many former Clinton supporters are feeling now.

We are disgusted with the party we have long trusted to represent our interests. We are disgusted with ourselves for being snookered - again. We assess the party leaders' rejection of Clinton as a cynical strategy. If Clinton had ended up as the candidate, the Democrats stood to lose the votes of many African Americans, who then might not vote at all. But if they made Obama the candidate? Well, then (the reasoning seems to have gone), the women always vote, and they will come around. Women always come around, no matter how badly they're mistreated.

Concluding her rant, Lakoff states

That's just how I feel. And they want my enthusiastic support? The Democratic Party can fend for itself.

Boy, can I relate to that!  Go, give this piece a full reading and if you are so moved write a letter to the editor of the SF Chron.
I plan to write both the Chron and Lakoff to thank her for speaking out.  Oh, and here is the link on Wikipedia about her work.  (It doesn't say anything about her marital status so I don't know if she was or still is married to George Lakoff.  He was recently on NPR and took some gratuitous digs at Hillary Clinton.
Perhaps this is a bone of contention in the family..)

Radiowalla :: "Democratic Party maybe presumes too much - about women"
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And here's a link to Lakoff's (0.00 / 0)
UC Berkeley profile:LINK .



Thanks. (0.00 / 0)
Just watched the atrocious Nancy Pelosi on the Daily Show.  Yeah, she is promoting her new book, "know your power", presumably about women in power.

Yeah, after all the utter nastiness she pulled on Hillary.  

Excuse me while I go barf!!


[ Parent ]
In pre-primary days (0.00 / 0)

I actually used to defend Pelosi when my "progressive" wingnut friends used to dis her.  Now they probably like her.  (I aways put progressives in quotation marks now, because they don't actually seem very progressive to me.)

[ Parent ]
Can Rahm Emmanuel be the new speaker (0.00 / 0)
after Bam Bam loses the election? Please? Emmanueal said Obama was weak and he was right. He supported Hillary until the end.

[ Parent ]
Did he really? (0.00 / 0)
I'm surprised to hear that.  I assumed he supported Obama because they are both from Illinois.


[ Parent ]
He supported Hillary until June 3 (0.00 / 0)
And at some Washington dinner during the primaries, some sort of roast, Emmanuel went on a riff of like three "Obama's so weak he" examples. Like the "you're mamma's so fat, she ..." riffs.

I think he jumped on board with Obama out of duty after Hillary suspended.

Also, some speculate he's a threat to Pelosi, and she wanted him to take Obama's senate seat (so her speakership position would be safe.)


[ Parent ]
Oops - not weak, soft (0.00 / 0)
I think the word he used was soft.

[ Parent ]
No Deal to Emanuel (0.00 / 0)
Emanuel should be on every PUMA shit list for this sexist and ageist comment about Hillary "holdouts"    

WTOP reported on June 12, in "Not all Democrats falling for Obama":

Rep. Rahm Emanuel...argues against reading too much into the holdouts. He said most of them always stay out of national politics and that the party is generally unified around Obama.

"They're just going to stick to their knitting," he said. "It's not that they're anti-Obama."



Alice left me in Wonderland.  

[ Parent ]
That is perfectly dreadful! (0.00 / 0)
What a terrible thing for him to say!  
Shame on you, Rahm!

[ Parent ]
Bad, but it is a pattern? (0.00 / 0)
Was this a blooper that he was (rightfully) slapped on the hand for, by his wife and other women in his circle?

Let's keep an eye on him.


[ Parent ]
BTW, forgot to say. (0.00 / 0)
Thanks for a great diary.  

[ Parent ]
Excellent write-up! Thank you! (0.00 / 0)
And, now it seems he's going to pick the first anti-choicer since before Bill Clinton to run on a national ticket for our Party.  Way to woo the Clinton voters.

Also, it's not just women.  My Dad feels the same way.

Medicare for All is Civil Rights


She's divorced, George Lakoff loves Obama (0.00 / 0)
Too funny. Go Robin Lakoff!

They are both linguistics professors at Cal.


I met him at a World Affairs Council event (0.00 / 0)
and I think he was with some other woman.  Not the one who is pictured in the Cal bio, at any rate.  Figures.



[ Parent ]
Oh maybe they're separated (0.00 / 0)
A younger person I know just graduated in linguistics, she took classes from both. She implied they were separated or divorced.

[ Parent ]
Dear Prudence (0.00 / 0)
Help!  My husband's an Obamabot and I'm a Puma.  We haven't talked since February.  What should I do?

[ Parent ]
re: What should I do? (0.00 / 0)

Talk to NewHampster; he might have some good advice, or at least good empathy.  (I think it's the flip for him.)

[ Parent ]
Wow.... my first diary (0.00 / 0)
and I make it to the big time!

Thanks, masslib.



your first (0.00 / 0)
great find, great diary!!

Hillary - alternative energy

[ Parent ]
And a very nice diary it is. :-) (0.00 / 0)


There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.

[ Parent ]
George Lakoff (0.00 / 0)

I heard him also on NPR dissing Hillary, and he also defended caucuses, saying how much more democratic they are than primaries.  I wanted to barf.  And I was disapppointed that the host didn't question him on that.  Is that the show you heard?  It was maybe a month or so ago?

He's one of those "create your own reality" guys.  Repeat a lie often enough and it becomes true.  His lie is "caucuses are very democratic."  NOT

I'm glad his wife has a different mindset!  He ought to listen to her more.

 


p.s. (0.00 / 0)

just read above they are no longer married. That's even better!  Smart woman.

[ Parent ]
Like in The Secret? (0.00 / 0)
"Create your own reality." See it and believe it! No wonder he's on Oprah's side.

[ Parent ]
Like in (0.00 / 0)

the Bushies' mindset.  Remember when White House Bushies staff said they weren't concerned about actual world events because they were creating their own reality?!  Maybe they read the Secret?

[ Parent ]
Obviously not a realist, nor a pragmatist. (0.00 / 0)
That's probably why Mr. Lakoff doesn't care for Senator Clinton, because she's both.

As far as the whole "create your own reality" thing, I defy anyone to "create" a reality that would cause me to lose my beloved husband in his 40s due to undiagnosed heart problems leading to a heart attack when he was both health-conscious and vigilant about his health; I defy anyone to "create" a reality that consists of wrenching poverty, homelessness, strife, and disease; I defy anyone to try to tell me I've "created my own reality" because I'm a broke, disabled widow -- because no one -- NO ONE -- would "create" this reality.

IOW, books like "The Secret" are extremely misleading at absolute best and are absolute frauds at absolute worst; they have a blame the victim mentality at their base, and thus, I despise them.  Because no one should blame me for the fact my husband died, thank you.  And if they do, well -- I'm polite, so I won't tell y'all what I'd like to say, but you can probably figure it out for yourselves.

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
The Secret made me question Oprah's judgement (0.00 / 0)
I'm all for self-help books that help you empower yourself or motivate yourself. But that book went beyond the help column and into the predatory one. She had the authors (or their flaks, I guess the authors never make public appearances) on not once, but she invited them back multiple times.

Her shows often market really expensive things nobody can afford. And in a way, good marketing can make you blame yourself, you just need their product to be the self-made woman!


[ Parent ]
Yes, that's the one I heard.! (0.00 / 0)
When the host mentioned a negative perception of Obama that is floating around (I forget which one!), Lakoff answered "You can thank Hillary Clinton for that!"

At that point, I moved to another podcast on my iPod.  



[ Parent ]
Uh, he gives Hillary too much credit (0.00 / 0)
Really, the credit belongs to Obama.

[ Parent ]
I think (0.00 / 0)
I actually turned my radio off, I was so disgusted with his "insights".

[ Parent ]
He was on Michael Krasney, gushing over Obama's empathy (0.00 / 0)
and the fawning Krasney agreed. That's when I turned off my radio.

[ Parent ]
gross (0.00 / 0)
how appalling.  

Hillary - alternative energy

[ Parent ]
Disgusting. We need less biased media coverage, not more. (0.00 / 0)
When the media-critters don't even bother trying to act impartially, that's when I don't bother with them.

PUMA all the way, baby.

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
WHAAAATTTT?!?!?! (0.00 / 0)
Caucuses are more democratic than primaries?

Jeeeezusssss!

From Iowa with love and regret.


[ Parent ]
He's trying to create (0.00 / 0)
his own framing!



[ Parent ]
Caucuses are much less democratic than primaries. More Orwellian doublespeak (0.00 / 0)
at work.

I suppose these idiots really do think "The Secret" works -- you put out there what you want everyone to believe, whether it's true or not, and at least some people will believe you.

However, as P.T. Barnum said, "There's a sucker born every minute."

I also believe as the wise Homey the Clown once said on "In Living Color," "Homey don't play that!"

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
The Secret (0.00 / 0)
is snake oil.


[ Parent ]
We love Robin (0.00 / 0)
The FEC reports that she gave $1000 to our girl.


Great article (0.00 / 0)
while the author may not be ready to say that she will not vote for Obama, I will.  Obama  will never get my vote.  The anti-Democratic party will not get my vote, my money,or my phone banking.  PUMA

No Obama. No way. (0.00 / 0)
I went on record in May with this belief and I stand by it -- I've seen absolutely nothing to change my mind, not one blessed thing.

Hillary Clinton is the only person I'm willing to support for POTUS -- and I went on record with that in February.  I have no reason to change my mind -- she is the person I will support, never, never, never Obama.

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
The Money Quote (0.00 / 0)
is here:
Women always come around, no matter how badly they're mistreated.

Until we demonstrate clearly to party leaders that this is no longer the way it is we will continue to get short shrift from them.

But let's not forget there's a lot more to this than angry women.  There are plenty of angry men, too.


"The Democratic Party can fend for itself" (0.00 / 0)
That is very polite language.  

That jumped out to me too (0.00 / 0)
You know that sentence replaced what was in her first draft.

[ Parent ]
Radiowalla, I'm glad you stuck around. You are (0.00 / 0)
one of my favorite PUMA Obama voters.  :0)

Medicare for All is Civil Rights

Thank you, masslib (0.00 / 0)
I don't go 'round The Convergence because the posters there were not able to tolerate my decision to vote for the nominee.  But I haven't been treated with anything but friendship here so that's why I stay.  

My main passions now are  (1) protesting the Democratic party's screwed-up nominating process;  (2) protesting the sexism that runs rampant in the media and in some party circles and (3) supporting Hillary Clinton and demanding that her name be placed in nomination at the convention.

If I vote for Obama...it's possible I won't if California isn't close... I will be doing it with no enthusiasm whatsoever.   McCain is anathema to me so I will never vote for him, that's for sure.



[ Parent ]
me too (0.00 / 0)
In California he may not need my vote, in which case, since he doesn't seem to want it, I won't burden him with it.  But, if it's close I'll vote for him, but I won't come around.  The DNC will get no more of my dimes, and I'll work with anyone who wants to start a new party, based on core Democratic principles and a sane idea of business and the environment.    

Hillary - alternative energy

[ Parent ]
do you live (0.00 / 0)
in Berkeley?  

Hillary - alternative energy

[ Parent ]
No, but I grew up there! (0.00 / 0)
Whenever I visit my friends there I'm astounded by how many Obama stickers and yard signs I see.  But I'm usually out of step with the majority of Berkeley folks.



[ Parent ]
We all must make our own choices. No problem with that. (0.00 / 0)
Radiowalla, the only people I get upset with who are supporting Obama are those who tell me I'm an idiot for not supporting him.  You obviously aren't in that category. :-)

Besides, my own father and brother will -- very reluctantly -- vote Obama at this point, because neither can stomach voting for McCain (Dad won't ever again vote Republican as he voted the first time for George W. Bush and deeply regrets it).

Mostly, I am backing Hillary Clinton and I want an open, fair convention where her name is entered into nomination, her delegates vote for her, speeches are made on her behalf, and she gets to have her speech.  If the Democrats stop standing in the way of all that -- well, then and only then might I consider voting for that nonentity Sebelius, who will almost assuredly be Obama's VP nominee.  (I still can't bring myself to ever vote Obama.)

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
i'm surprised the chronicle ran that op-ed (0.00 / 0)
check out the comments section.  Just a rabid collection of the usual lying Obama supporters Clinton haters.

dante never had to write about listening to an obama supporter whine.


re: (0.00 / 0)
"We are disgusted with ourselves for being snookered - again...Women always come around, no matter how badly they're mistreated."

If Robin Lakoff really gets this, her very own words, then how can she vote for BHO?  She would be letting herself be snookered again.  I will not let the Party snooker me!  No way will I vote for the DNC's chosen candidate.  It's the voters, stupid!  (paraphrasing here) We have to be tough with the Party who threw out millions of its own voters.  For the first time in my life I will not vote for the Democratic Party's nominee.



"Always aim high, work hard, and care deeply about what you believe in. When you stumble, keep faith. When you?re knocked down, get right back up. And NEVER listen to anyone who says you can't or shouldn't go on."
Hillary Clinton - June 7, 2008

Hillary Clinton
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