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Alegre's Corner
We're not finished folks - not by a long shot!

Why I am a PUMA Democrat -- and why Hillary Clinton has nothing to do with it.

by: LSekhmet

Sat Aug 16, 2008 at 16:01:01 PM EDT


While watching David Shuster castigate Darragh Murphy and Will Bower for being PUMAs on a recent edition of MSNBO's "Hardball," I realized that perhaps a few of the members of the mainstream media don't really understand what makes someone a PUMA Democrat when he or she has always supported the Democratic Party up until now.

I'm going to assume that Shuster is clueless, rathar than deliberately obtuse; clueless I can work with and try to educate, while deliberately obtuse leave me with only the choice to avoid the person who's using that particular strategem . . . and thus, here starts my post on "What, exactly, makes me a PUMA Democrat?"

LSekhmet :: Why I am a PUMA Democrat -- and why Hillary Clinton has nothing to do with it.
Note to mainstream media members: I was a long-time Democratic voter, who supported at least 90% Democrats since voting for the first time in 1983 (voting in every available election for anything, including school boards and dog catchers).  Oddly enough, I did not support Bill Clinton in 1992 because I was very angered by the way the Democratic Party had shielded Dan Rostenkowski, then-powerful Chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee and refused to vote for a Democrat as President that year -- instead, I voted as a protest for Ross Perot (I thought him personally screwy, but his ideas on the economy were sound).

I start out with that because one of the myths about PUMAs is that we supposedly all were Bill Clinton voters who magically somehow transferred our affections to his wife, Hillary R. Clinton, when she decided to run for President -- and that's the furthest thing from the case (at least in my book).

I had nothing against Hillary R. Clinton at the start of this election cycle, but I was against what was called "the Imperial Presidency" -- i.e., two Bushes and then perhaps two Clintons in the highest office in the land in the past 20 years.  Which means Hillary R. Clinton had to work her keister off to show me who she was, and how she'd govern, even though I had no dislike of her, simply because I was wary of the whole "Imperial Presidency" argument.  (My late husband and I came up with that term way back in '02, btw.  I know sometimes terms happen via gestalt and many people come up with similar or the exact same terms around the same time.  Just postulate that this wasn't a new concern of mine, and be done with it, OK?)

I also have to admit that I viewed Hillary R. Clinton as the establishment candidate (how wrong I was, but I digress); this didn't help, either.

So, this year, I started out as a supporter of John Edwards; I liked his health care plan, I liked his care for our veterans and the poor.  I believed he had workable programs, and I really thought his wife had a lot on the ball, which reflected nicely upon him.  (This was long before there was any confirmation of the scandal in which he's now embroiled; I still think very highly of Elizabeth Edwards and always will.  And note that no matter how flawed a messenger John Edwards was and remains, his programs are still sound and would work.)

When Edwards dropped out, I evaluated the remaining candidates thusly:

Bill Richardson: Overblown windbag, smart, but full of himself.  He did not get my vote.  (Nor many others.)

Barack Obama:  This was tougher, because I'd read Sen. Obama's book "The Audacity of Hope" and thought it an interesting political memoir.  But I did not feel that was enough to base a Presidential campaign upon; further, I felt very strongly that Sen. Obama should've served at least one full term in the Senate before running for President (at least John Edwards served five years of his Senate term before he ran in '04).  

And the longer I watched Obama, the less I trusted him or liked him; my evaluation was, then and now, that he is not ready for the Presidency at this time, and should learn more about how our government actually works in the U.S. Senate before he makes (another) full-fledged run for the Presidency.  (We're seeing his inexperience up-front and personal now, especially with the whole crisis overseas in Georgia; Obama's response was lackluster at best, and made while he was on vacation.  I still wonder why he's gone on so many vacations; how many vacations does a healthy 47-year-old man need?)

Dennis Kucinich and Mike Gravel I dismissed right off; I thought both had something interesting to say (though Gravel is really over-the-top in how he says it), but I knew they'd never garner enough support to win the Presidential nomination (in a normal year, where the DNC isn't trying to manipulate everything).

Thus, I came around to looking at Hillary R. Clinton for herself, and I liked what I saw; she was competent, she was qualified, she quickly educated herself on any new problem and remembered what she learned effortlessly.  Definitely the right candidate for me, despite being married to a former President, and I gladly gave her my vote when I got the chance to cast it on a cold February day in WI.

At any rate, then came the caucus manipulations in other states; the outright fraud of the DNC's Rules and Bylaws Committee meeting of 5/31/08 in giving Sen. Obama 59 delegates he hadn't earned from MI (including 4 of Sen. Clinton's earned delegates), then halving them; the ridiculous and pointless statements by Pelosi, Dean, occasionally by Harry Reid, and many by Donna Brazile.  I learned that I was not wanted or valued by anyone in the Democratic Party, save perhaps by Hillary Clinton.

Still.  Hillary Clinton is not the reason I am a PUMA; had the DNC's Rules and Bylaws Committee meeting done this on behalf of Senator Clinton, I'd be just as outraged on Obama's behalf despite the fact I didn't vote for him and have no interest in ever doing so.

Simply put: I am a PUMA because the Democratic process was thwarted.  Period.  And that has nothing to do with Hillary Clinton whatsoever.

And I will remain a PUMA as long as I continue to see corruption in what remains of the Democratic Party.

Btw, whom I support is none of your business, but yes; I do continue to support Hillary Clinton, because she at least learned my issues and my interests and figured out a way to talk with me and voters like me -- and point out that she has a way to better our lives by improving the economy and getting universal health care (getting rid of all the duplication of forms would be a great start) and working on the various strategies for lowering gas prices.

In other words, while Hillary R. Clinton decidedly speaks to me and for me in many respects, my vote is my own -- and despite the fact that I continue to support her, my decision to be a PUMA has nothing to do with her at all.

Most PUMAs I know support Hillary R. Clinton as a candidate because we know she was "done dirty" by the DNC.  And we don't approve of unethical treatment of the lack of fair play, especially when it works against the only candidate who seemed to have any idea of how to help the forgotten lower, working and middle classes of the United States of America.

So, in essence, here's my take on why I am a PUMA:

I believe in ethics in government.

I believe in fair play and consistently-applied rules (not just Donna Brazile's "make up your own rules and apply 'em whenever you feel like it" nonsense, then say you were applying 'em straight up later on; yeah, sure).

I believe in fair reflection, and that votes should count as the voters intended them -- not by making up new voter counts on the spot and imputing motives to these phantoms later (as in the atrocious 5/31/08 RBC meeting of the DNC).

I believe the DNC must be reformed until such time it fairly reflects the will of the voters, not just the will of the party elites.

And I believe this:

My vote is my own.

My conscience is my own.

I will never vote for Barack Obama, as he was enabled and uplifted by those who did their best to subvert the will of the voters throughout the 2008 primary election cycle (most especially in his campaign staff.)

That, in essence, is what makes me a PUMA Democrat.

Hillary Clinton, as great a lady as she is, really doesn't have anything to do with my decision.  (Got it, Shuster?  Good.)

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Maybe this will help educate the MSM. (0.00 / 0)
One can only hope. ;-)

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.

I sure hope they read this diary! (0.00 / 0)


[ Parent ]
We can always hope, Sharyn. :-) (0.00 / 0)
If they do, maybe they will be educated -- however, it's more likely they'll still insist I'm a Republican (using it as a swear word, of course, though the "Great Obama (TM)" said himself that he doesn't think Republican is a swear word at all in his 2004 speech, or at least implied it) and am doing this for some unscrupulous reason, doing my best to manipulate true, honest, loyal, brave, thrifty and reverent Democratic Party voters into saying, "Party Unity, My (behind)!"  Because they'd otherwise never do any such thing.  /end sarcasm

Sharyn, I'm so disgusted by the MSM and I want them to knock this off.  They need to start reporting facts, and finding stories, not just making stuff up and then saying they're right when the true facts and stories pop up later anyway (as they so often do); these people literally don't know how to backtrack or apologize, and I find that shocking -- also very sad.

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
great diary! rec'd. (0.00 / 0)

I just took your poll, and his biggest problem is mostly the top three; but beyond all, he is a horrible journalist. He shouldn't even be called a journalist.

My process to supporting PUMA is very similar to yours.  I am so upset at the way the DNC has been rigging this election (yes, I do think it's been rigged), I will for the first time in my life NOT vote for the Democratic candidate.  It's ALWAYS been my pattern to vote for the most progressive candidate in the primary, but then go all out for and enthusiastically support the Party's nominee in the GE. That's because the nominee won the nomination fairly and squarely.  This time, NOT; and I'm glad there are many of us that saw through the MSM's failure to accurately report the Party leadership shennanigans.

Like you I was leaning to Edwards early on, but once the debates started, that quickly changed.  It's one thing to fight corruption; I'm all for that!  But when he started blaming Hillary Clinton for all the corruption in the world, he totally lost me.  Then I was leaning to Joe Biden and Hillary, and I always liked Kucinich even though he didn't have a prayer.  My support for Hillary kept on growing for the reasons you outlined above.  She got shafted by her own Party, and I do not want to let the Party get away with it.  

Well, this is kind of a long comment, so I'll quit for now.  Thanks again for this excellent diary.


You're welcome, and I agree. (0.00 / 0)
I didn't approve of the two-person "tag team" when Edwards and Obama both went after Hillary Clinton in at least one debate; I thought that unchivalrous and unnecessary, both.

I'm glad you enjoyed my diary, Sharyn. :-)

As for this -- I've supported an Independent candidate before on principle, even though I had no dislike of Bill Clinton (didn't care for his womanizing ways, but that's between he and Hillary Clinton; it's their marriage, not mine, and I really don't think it had anything to do with how he governed).  This year, I will be doing so again, as I cannot vote McCain and I will never vote Obama.  Ever.

The only way a Democrat can win this year is if it's Hillary Clinton; otherwise, McCain will be our next President.  Thanks a whole heap, DNC!  (As I said at one of my comments elsewhere on Alegre's Corner today, Howard Dean is to blame for this because he didn't put a stop to any of the caucus violations or the misogynistic media or do anything at all to stop the horrible Rules and Bylaws Committee meeting of 5/31/08.)

Or, to put it more shortly and bluntly:  Howard Dean is to blame for me being a PUMA.  Donna Brazile is, too.

Hillary Clinton, God bless her, has nothing to do with my decision to stand on principle and reject an unprincipled, flawed candidate propped up by unprincipled, flawed and devious men and women.

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
Yes! (0.00 / 0)
Tell it like it is ... I just hope Howard "gets it" at some point.

[ Parent ]
What a nice, thoughtful and logical construct. (0.00 / 0)
Kudos for such fine writing, and argument. WE are so often lumping and clumping voters and ideas recklessly. You have shown, I believe quite uniquely to this election cycle, that a lot of voters felt deeply and cared at length about issues, values and candidates to support. All the more offensive such trite Obeymatoid charges as racism, hatred, drama, politics etc. The pumas in reality represent the true fuel of democracy, big D, that is. Glad to have learned of your journey.

Still Hearting Hillary, In Slo-Mo toward McCain

Thank you, Sharmajee. (0.00 / 0)
I did my best, and I appreciate your kind words.

I agree with this statement of yours wholeheartedly:

. . .a lot of voters felt deeply and cared at length about issues, values and candidates to support. All the more offensive such trite Obeymatoid charges as racism, hatred, drama, politics etc. The pumas in reality represent the true fuel of democracy, big D, that is.

Just had to quote that again. ;-)

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
David Schuster cut his teeth (0.00 / 0)
reporting on the Whitewater "scandal," and has harbored a tremendous animus towards the Clintons ever since then.  Early in the primary season, he filled in for Hillary-hater Ed Schultz and spent the entire program slamming Hillary.  As my late father used to say, I wouldn't p*ss on him if he were on fire.

Your journey to becoming a PUMA was very well presented and I completely share your anger at the DNC and their totalitarian Rules and Bylaws Committee.  For me, that meeting was the last straw and I registered as "decline to state" the very next week.  

As you say, our votes belong to us alone.  My own vote right now is undecided.  If California is close, I will vote for the Democratic nominee because I don't want another Republican near the White House, no matter what.   Mr. Radiowalla is quick to point out to me that if California is close, then it will mean that the Democrats are doomed anyway.  I think he's right.



If BHO is the nominee (0.00 / 0)
and the polls are close in my state, then I'll vote for McCain.  (first time I will not vote for Dem)  I absolutely cannot take any part in letting the Dem leadership get away with the dirty tricks they pulled in this primary season.

[ Parent ]
I completely understand (0.00 / 0)
how you feel.  

[ Parent ]
Thanks, Radiowalla. (0.00 / 0)
I know what you mean; I may face the same problem in WI, but I'm hoping not.  I know McCain's policies are wrong for the US at this time, but Obama's no better and I find him highly unethical and unprincipled, besides.

At this point, I lean toward Cynthia McKinney, an African-American Democrat running as the Green Party candidate for President.  I can support her wholeheartedly; now, if she doesn't get on the ballot in WI (I don't know the status of the Greens in WI), I might vote for Bob Barr instead if he's on the ballot and she's not, because like McCain, I know exactly where Bob Barr stands.  And he is at least anti-war and for privacy rights (he's the Libertarian candidate for President, and a former Republican).

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
If I don't vote Obama, I will write in Hillary (0.00 / 0)
as McKinney and Barr are both unacceptable to me for a variety of reasons, none of which are of interest on this blog.   As it stands now, I won't decide until the last minute anyway.  However, if any pollster asks me, I am going to tell them I won't be voting for Obama under any circumstances.....I just want to worry the Democrats as much as I can!



[ Parent ]
My preferred choice is to write in Senator Clinton, yes. (0.00 / 0)
But I don't know if that vote will count for Obama in a decidedly pro-Obama state, which is why right now I'm leaning toward either McKinney or Barr.  They're not perfect, but they're a whole lot better than Obama IMO.

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.

[ Parent ]
hmmm ... (0.00 / 0)
Interesting - please educate me.  Do you think there is a chance of a Hillary write-in vote being counted as a vote for Obama!?   We cannot have this happening.

[ Parent ]
Depends, I suppose, on who is counting the votes (0.00 / 0)
If it's the DNC, then such a scenario is quite plausible.  ;-)

[ Parent ]
I don't know. (0.00 / 0)
But Radiowalla nailed it; because of how biased the bulk of the DNC has behaved throughout, I just don't trust anyone.

Thanks a whole heap (again), DNC!

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
You took the words right outta my head (0.00 / 0)
Thanks for this wonderful diary, highly recommended. Your road to PUMA was not travelled alone, that's for sure. Oh and Shuster is a hack, he doesn't even try to hide his disdain for the Clintons or their supporters, never could. He can p*ss up a rope.

Thanks, Soupcity. I appreciate that. (0.00 / 0)
And I agree -- Shuster can, indeed, pee up a rope.  Because he doesn't even try to hide his bias; he exploits it, instead, and expects to be glorified because of it.  Ugh!

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.

[ Parent ]
and I especially hope (0.00 / 0)

Shuster reads your post here -- and Chuck Todd too. That's the guy who said PUMAs were a creation of the Upper Eastside.  Todd is in a more insulated bubble than the D.C. politicians he reports on.  We need a 5th estate to go after the pathetic 4th estate, who don't give dip about getting and reporting facts.

I wonder what Dana Priest is up to these days; she did a good job investigating Walter Reed and Guantanamo.  We need a Priest to investigate the Democratic primaries in the same way.


Thanks, Sharyn. (0.00 / 0)
Shuster will be appalled, then figure we're all figments of his imagination or something.  (See what I said, sarcastically, way above thread, where I said about how the "brave, thrifty, reverent, etc. real Democratic voters" would never be led astray by a PUMA Democrat -- :rolls eyes: -- paraphrasing my own words, with an eye-roll included.)  I don't know what Chuck Todd will think, or even if he'll give it a second thought; I'm sure he thinks we're all Republicans.

Look, guys -- if you are reading this, I am not a Republican.  I'm a Democrat, and a tired one; I'm tired of this nonsense, tired of this crap, and I don't believe in "unity" for the sake of . . . nothing at all.  (See my earlier diary -- "Donna Brazile Once Again Calls for 'Unity.'  No, thank you."  Located here: http://alegrescorner.soapblox.... -- for further details.)

Thanks again, Sharyn, for enjoying my diary and the comments so much.  Keep it up!  (I'm glad my work was appreciated today by so many.)

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
I met a PUMA today who's never heard of PUMAs (0.00 / 0)
a woman who does not like Obama, has always been a Dem, and hopes the nomination is turned over to Hillary. She doesn't even read blogs. She's never heard of PUMAs. She is disabled and relies heavily on the Americans with Disabilities Act yet will vote McCain because she finds him more honest. I woman who attended Berkeley in the 1960s and marched for Civil Rights. She's a PUMA and she doesn't even know it.

PUMA!

Great diary and highly recommended!


Thanks, Catfish. (0.00 / 0)
And God (and Goddess) bless women like the lady you met today; truly, they (and we) are the heart and soul of democracy, not these elitist, entitled politicians who've mucked up the works.

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.

[ Parent ]
Damn, you left my pick off the list (0.00 / 0)
It's okay, it happens.

Tracy's pick:  David Schuster has no true self esteem and must daily attempt to shock and awe an audience into giving him the attention his ego craves ravenously.  He's an adolescent Chris Matthews.


Sorry to have missed that one, Tracy. (0.00 / 0)
I agree with you; low self esteem is definitely a part of it, as is trying to compete with Chris Matthews.

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.

[ Parent ]
Excellent LSek (0.00 / 0)
Thanks for saying what I've been thinking how to say.

For me it ceased to be about Hillary on June 7.  But more importantly, I'm a male PUMA because I've seen since New Hampshire that this was a competition between Excellence and Salesmanship.  Between one person who spent her life understanding and analyzing the issues and an opponent who spent his life understanding and analyzing how to win.

To him and the leaders of the party the issues and the people are second to winning at all costs.  It is all about winning the Presidency, not doing the job of President.

To me that sounds like the Republicans I've always known and the Democrats have become them.  

PUMA


Fighting for women at Partizane


Winning at all costs ... (0.00 / 0)
I totally agree with your excellent post.

[ Parent ]
You're quite welcome, NH. (0.00 / 0)
I am glad you appreciated it, and I hope it does some good.  Believe it or not, there really are people who believe all the myths about PUMAs -- that we're all Republicans, for example -- and they need to be educated.  If at all possible.

Note that the worst legacy from this disputed and protested election is that genuine Obama supporters (not O-bots, but real supporters of Obama because of his platform or his policies) have been divided from their fellow Democrats.  Most of the genuine Obama supporters have no quarrel with us -- and I know that because some of the Colorado Obama delegation actually signed as delegates to put Senator Clinton's name in nomination.  

Those people are not our enemies, and we need to remember it; it's those who've profited off this mess that are, and those latter individuals are the ones we need to get on out of the DNC.  

The political consultants who have enabled Obama, IMO, need to be sued if they've done anything illegal.  If it's just immoral, then I'd hope they do some stuff of a true public service nature, like making food for soup kitchens and helping the homeless.  Maybe that will make 'em wake up.  Because we're talking about someone who is important to the nation as our next President -- not just a symbol.  

Maybe they've lost touch with those of us "on the ground," and that's why they're behaving so badly.  One can hope for a good reason like that one, rather than a bad one such as, "They're all corrupt because they want to be."

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
I agree (0.00 / 0)
Team Obama has run a scorched earth campaign to win, wrote a talking point that the Clintons were to blame, and their top surrogate, the Obamedia, ran with the meme. After 8 years of having an incompetent administration in the White House, the American people want a competent, experienced President. The Democratic Party has a choice it's either Hillary or McCain.  

Alice left me in Wonderland.  

[ Parent ]
Right On! (0.00 / 0)
Excellent!  You summed-up all that I have been feeling about this Primary and the failings of the DNC and Democracy.  This should be cross-posted on other forums -- and the DNC could learn a thing or two here as well.

Thanks, Cameoanne. (0.00 / 0)
If anyone wants to spread it around -- mentioning where this is, and that I wrote it -- feel free.  You have my permission.

And if anyone can get the Just Say No Deal coalition itself to take notice of this post, please give it a try.  I don't know those folks -- well, there are a lot of us out here that are protesting this election -- and I think that hampers me when I write things.  I am not as "connected," perhaps, though I do know a lot of people here and am glad and grateful for that.  (That's a long-winded way to say that I, myself, have been unable to get the JSND coalition interested in my posts before.  Unfortunately.  They didn't even like the one about Donna Brazile!)

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
Richardson Statement (0.00 / 0)
Did anyone just hear Bill Richardson on Late Edition with Blitzer?   Blitzer asked if Richardson was comfortable with Hillary on the ballot in Denver.  He hem'd and haw'd for a second or two and then said (paraphase); "Yes, now I am, because Hillary will release her pledged delegates to Senator Obama.  A deal has been worked-out".

WTF?  I hate this.  Do we have to have a "Deal"?  Is this Democracy?   How about just having a straight-up delegate roll-call and whomever wins is President!   This is the only scenario I can accept.


BHO ought to release his delegates. (0.00 / 0)


[ Parent ]
Yes! (0.00 / 0)
Heh!  I could support - and hope for - this scenario 100%.

[ Parent ]
I agree, Sharyn and Cameoanne. (0.00 / 0)
Barack Obama can release his delegates.  Let the chips fall where they may.  (And I bet you anything, the political analysts would hate that, and be protesting that -- well, how do they like it now that they have to contemplate that remote possibility for themselves?  And what made them think we liked it any better, especially after we believe this election was "encouraged" on behalf of Senator Obama from the start?)

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.

[ Parent ]
I don't trust Bill Richardson as far as I could throw him. (0.00 / 0)
So I'd take anything he says with a big grain of salt.

Personally, I think he's just trying to stir us up, and/or pacify the Obama people.  But why he'd want to do either, I just don't know; is he hoping to play both sides of the fence after all this nonsense?

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
I echo every sentiment LSekhmet ! (0.00 / 0)
Thanks for the great diary, from another Edwards supporter.

When it came down to Obama and Hillary, there was no contest in my heart and mind.

I've known Hillary and her work for YEARS, Obama just couldn't measure up to her.

I'm a Puma now, because "we wuz robbed".  And like Perry Logan said "you don't go Rovian on your own party" !


Thanks, Diggins. (0.00 / 0)
I agree; there was no contest.  I believe a President is more than a symbol, though I understand and respect the symbolic nature of the office.  The person we elect must be competent and qualified -- and IMO, Barack Obama is neither at this point in time, though had he waited and served a term or two in the Senate before running for the Presidency, perhaps he would've been.

Now, though -- it'll never happen.

Granted, Obama has held true on one of his promises -- that he would unite Republicans and Democrats (and Independents, too, no doubt).

But I'm sure he didn't believe it would happen because we all united -- against him!

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
Excellent post (0.00 / 0)
Just excellent. I'm a PUMA for many of the same reasons you are (except for Edwards). The decision to initially strip FL and MI were asinine, especially FL.  

Alice left me in Wonderland.  

Thanks, Grlpatriot. (0.00 / 0)
I just don't approve of how the DNC has behaved this year whatsoever, and I'm appalled at how childish/insecure and immature they are.  They don't take responsibility for anything -- at least, Howard Dean and Donna Brazile don't, and Nancy Pelosi as one of the heads of the Democratic Party (one of the most powerful people within it) also certainly doesn't.  Just awful, all that, and I don't approve whatsoever.

Let's hope this diary changes some minds -- because as I've said before, it's not the vast majority of the honest Obama supporters that we are fighting -- it is the DNC itself.

There's no excuse for this, DNC.  None.


[ Parent ]
"Always aim high, work hard, and care deeply about what you believe in. When you stumble, keep faith. When you?re knocked down, get right back up. And NEVER listen to anyone who says you can't or shouldn't go on."
Hillary Clinton - June 7, 2008

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